ASTTBC Province Wide

Discussion regarding testing & inspection of fire safety equipment, Code issues, commentary, and interpretation.

ASTTBC Province Wide

Postby sparky » Tue Aug 24, 2010 7:53

ASTTBC possible being made province wide is a MASSIVE mistake. They can't even provide proper training for requirements now. I hope the industry and Safety Authority comes together and ends this non-sense.
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Re: ASTTBC Province Wide

Postby FIRETEK » Wed Aug 25, 2010 10:01

The way I see it you can take one of two roads. You can take the one that views organizations like ASTTBC and CFAA as "money grabs", or you can take the one that requires you to actually participate in ensuring the success of their mandates. For the latter "road", you have to take a step beyond a dues paying member, and engage as a pro-active, committed individual. In other words: "Kwitcher whinin' and do somethin'!" :D

I view a Provincial mandate for ASTTBC as a positive step. Granted, we all have a long hard road ahead, but if we all start working at it instead of sitting on the fence complaining (or watching), the standard of practice WILL improve and we'll have a governing body with the power to ensure the proper educational requirements are being met as well as one that will see to the ongoing technical development of their members!

ASTTBC won't be able to do this on their own. They will require financial assistance from the Province and that's something we should all be lobbying for (as members and as a concerned public).
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Re: ASTTBC Province Wide

Postby Fire-Works » Fri Aug 27, 2010 3:35

Unless companies(Owners/Presidents off) are held accountable for the work their Tech`s do then I do see the point off having any governance of Techs. I see that 2 Techs from Fire & Safety Services have been find, yet nothing against the company.
Two Techs may have found themselves fired(I really don`t know if they where or not) to protect the company. The company, any company not just Fire & Safety Services get to hire 2 more techs and hope they make more money before they get caught again. (I`am not sure but was this this companies first trouble?)
As I see it now the Tech`s take all the responsibility yet the company takes the money, not a bad deal for the company, which could also fire you for taking to long to do a job by following the rules.
As I see it right now the ASTTBC has done nothing to make people safer,(ref Fire & Safety Services where 2 Techs are fined and so far the company has not been fined or had conditions put upon it) they only gave companies a way out of taking responsibility for there workers.JMO
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Re: ASTTBC Province Wide

Postby FIRETEK » Sat Aug 28, 2010 10:04

I appreciate the fact that you haven't come right out and mentioned Active Fire, but I think everyone reading your response will know whom you're referencing regardless. So, let's bring everyone "up to speed" on a few things you’ve touched on. The two techs involved in the story have not been fired. In fact, they're "out there" with the knowledge that ASTTBC is watching every move they make. I wish I could categorically state that Active technicians (including the owner) are not undergoing further complaint investigations, but alas, this is not the case. Updated Special Report here.

In my recent response to Martin Sennott, Solicitor for Active Fire, you will recall I referenced “acts of misfeasance” amongst some other generalized comments that alluded to a corporate culture that continues to negatively impact the safety of the public. I’m presently working on an update to this story that will hopefully shake a few loose screws back into place because unlike Mr. Sennott suggests, no one is out to destroy Active Fire or more specifically, the technicians working for them. I’m of the firm belief that this company can be turned around, but that’s got to happen from the inside. How you might ask? Thanks to ASTTBC’s direct involvement and continued oversight. If you’re a tech working for Active Fire, you can pretty well be guaranteed that you’re automatically “on the radar”. If you can’t find the backbone to stand up to the management, ASTTBC is going to be both your girdle and your guide (OK, you might not like the reference to "girdle", but it certainly fits - pardon the pun).

The following doesn't just apply to the Technicians working for Active Fire and Safety Services: Download the Practice Guidelines here. Make sure you request all the latest Codes and Standards be added to the company's “Library” and made readily available for review. Insist on being given the time to properly review reports BEFORE they’re sent on to the customer and make sure the one you sign and stamp isn’t “watered down” from any observations you’ve made in the field by management (read, initial and stamp every page to make sure). Write deficiencies on your tags and make sure the building management is provided a copy that they’ll be able to compare to the completed report they receive. Yes, you might be going against established company procedures but it’s YOUR STAMP and YOUR REPUTATION on the line (as well as that of your employer’s).

You're quite right that ASTTBC can’t (at present) touch the owners of companies whose technicians exhibit the kind of unprofessional conduct we’ve seen, but they can certainly provide the kind of positive influence necessary to help the employee technicians. Those that continue down the road of indifference and unprofessional conduct (just plain don't give a damn), will reap the justice they deserve and that too, will serve to improve the standard of practice in the long run.
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Re: ASTTBC Province Wide

Postby sparky » Mon Sep 06, 2010 2:16

“The goal of the Fire Protection Technician Certification Program is to ensure that technicians conducting inspection and testing of fire protection and life safety systems have the required knowledge and training to provide accurate inspection and testing as required by code and are professionally certified to ensure full accountability."

The required knowledge and training? Who are we kidding here. The training is a joke. "347 is not that bad." Said instructor. Someone is going to get killed. The lack of training is ridiculis. They can't even provide courses for the technicians now in the jurisdictions they are in. Now they are lobbying for province wide jurisdiction? Instead of pushing for a province wide mandate how about actually provide your current members with useful training and seminars.

ASTTBC a cash grab? Purhaps. I am not one to really say for sure. It's tough to want to support them when really it's been nothing but disappointments since inception.
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Re: ASTTBC Province Wide

Postby FIRETEK » Mon Sep 06, 2010 9:41

I think you're addressing two important issues here. Before ASTTBC's "arrival", the industry in Vancouver was a "free for all". The reason Vancouver decided to mandate certification was that a benchmark could be established from where many thought the industry could move "forward" in a positive direction. (Second) From everything I've heard (from RFPT's I work with on a daily basis), the training courses could use a lot more "hands on" stuff (the fact that most think "cash grab" also concerns me but I know that this is something Brian Stegavig is trying hard to rectify). The issue you mentioned with the 347 is a huge concern (your comment vis-a-vis the instructor troubles me deeply) considering you're not even allowed to breathe on it let alone touch it without written permission. There's a FAQ on the subject which also made it into Issue #11 of SUPRESS! (hopefully many have read it and will take it to heart). I hear your frustration, believe me. It's the whole reason for this website and for this forum. You can do your bit by sharing your knowledge and helping to improve the standard of practice (did I mention you could also become a member?) :D
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Re: ASTTBC Province Wide

Postby firetruk » Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:04

Well here is my frustration - Money Grab you Say - You betcha.....!!!!

I am a graduate of a 3 year Fire Protection Program accepted Continent Wide (sorry that is a lie - Every Where BUT BC).

I have to take the "Challenge Exams". I have more knowledge from the 3 year course than the twice weekly acceptable course from BCIT.

No not a money grab at all - pleease.

And yeah - I have worked with and met way too many "certified and qualified" RFPT's that should NOT be touching electricity. I also don't believe only an electrician should be touching Fire Alarm - as many don'y understand. That goes for TQ sprinkler fitters as well. The "profession" needs to be a hybrid trade and technician certification. The schooling and apprenticeship needs to be beyond what is offered.

The industry here is a joke. Been here almost 20 years and it has not got better.
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Re: ASTTBC Province Wide

Postby FIRETEK » Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:42

Actually, if you read the Bylaws carefully for each Lower Mainland Jurisdiction, most do leave some "wiggle room" to accept an alternate "certification program" (like CFAA, for instance). The problem with CFAA at the moment (December 2014), is that there is no disciplinary component for technicians that engage in unprofessional conduct or practice. I would encourage you to join your local BC Chapter and add your voice/ideas to the chorus.
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